Liedership by the Panderer in Chief

[Tree]

Fine, Real job loss #s, economic growth reports, domestic policy, social issues, which tax level is appropriate, how much regulation is necessary, how much $ should one keep.....all that is debatable. What is not debatable, is an American Embassy and that is American soil, was attacked on 9/11, 4 Americans murdered, requests for beefed security were denied and there has been no appropriate American response to exact justice. In fact, Obama and his Administration to a man and woman, lied for the cause and blamed it on a stupid video and covered it up. How stupid does he think the US electorate is?
This President has shown no class at best.
You lefties should boot his ass out of the Oval Office. Watch this from your trusted guy Anderson Cooper.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/elec...istration/

[Petrovale]

With the help of IOC, I will soon establish a new, offshore PetrOvale Office to help you guys build real leadership.

[jft310]

NG and transportation must happen in some form . Fuel cells are 20 years away I think

[Palm]

I'll gladly redirect my tax payments to you Petro!

[Petrovale]

Mind you, I will introduce a rigorous job rotation plan in the PetrOvale office, one that completely disregards partisan schisms. Professional politicians without business experience, otherwise known as technocrats, will be immediately sacked. Those with banking and industrial backgrounds swap jobs, so that they get to know the other side of the rope. Economists and lawyers will have to learn to do some gardening at times, and study the flowers and the beys. Just to make sure that your tax money will be spent to promote collaborative partnerships that power the economic engine, especially in the area of innovative energy / security ventures. This time around, we discuss the horny issue of foreign policy well before you make your first tax payment as it should be a key priority on the national agenda.

Further suggestions welcome...

[ArtM72]

Fine, Real job loss #s, economic growth reports, domestic policy, social issues, which tax level is appropriate, how much regulation is necessary, how much $ should one keep.....all that is debatable. What is not debatable, is an American Embassy and that is American soil, was attacked on 9/11, 4 Americans murdered, requests for beefed security were denied and there has been no appropriate American response to exact justice. In fact, Obama and his Administration to a man and woman, lied for the cause and blamed it on a stupid video and covered it up. How stupid does he think the US electorate is? This President has shown no class at best. You lefties should boot his ass out of the Oval Office. Watch this from your trusted guy Anderson Cooper. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/elec...istration/

I would argue it is also debatable just how much security is enough.  Certainly there has been a debate in Congress as to how much money should be given the State Department for security.  State's requests have seen the budget axe the past two years.  After all, you can't protect every Federal employee and facility from every potential threat.

Tree, you and Petrovale undoubtably get your information from a very narrow cross section of the media.  How any reasoned person can write  "In fact, Obama and his Administration to a man and woman, lied for the cause and blamed it on a stupid video and covered it up" is beyond me.  In fact?  You have to be kidding. That is a statement of such gross ignorance I just couldn't let it go unchallenged.  Let the investigations proceed as to who was responsible for the Libyan deaths, and the environment in which they made their attack.  Calling everyone in the State Department and Administration a liar makes you look and sound like a real jerk.

Here's a link to a Christian Science Monitor piece on the State Department budget issue and a couple of people who voted down the Department's requests. http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchannels/2012/1005/Libya-attack-Congressmen-casting-blame-voted-to-cut-diplomatic-security-budget .  Sure there are lots of blogs out there saying different things, but I trust you can summon the critical thinking skills I know you have to ferret out a better opinion than the one you provided above.

Best regards,

[admin]

Gents, once again, I understand that passions run high, but really try to keep it civil..

[Tree]

Fine, Real job loss #s, economic growth reports, domestic policy, social issues, which tax level is appropriate, how much regulation is necessary, how much $ should one keep.....all that is debatable. What is not debatable, is an American Embassy and that is American soil, was attacked on 9/11, 4 Americans murdered, requests for beefed security were denied and there has been no appropriate American response to exact justice. In fact, Obama and his Administration to a man and woman, lied for the cause and blamed it on a stupid video and covered it up. How stupid does he think the US electorate is? This President has shown no class at best. You lefties should boot his ass out of the Oval Office. Watch this from your trusted guy Anderson Cooper. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/elec...istration/

I would argue it is also debatable just how much security is enough.  Certainly there has been a debate in Congress as to how much money should be given the State Department for security.  State's requests have seen the budget axe the past two years.  After all, you can't protect every Federal employee and facility from every potential threat.

Tree, you and Petrovale undoubtably get your information from a very narrow cross section of the media.  How any reasoned person can write  "In fact, Obama and his Administration to a man and woman, lied for the cause and blamed it on a stupid video and covered it up" is beyond me.  In fact?  You have to be kidding. That is a statement of such gross ignorance I just couldn't let it go unchallenged.  Let the investigations proceed as to who was responsible for the Libyan deaths, and the environment in which they made their attack.  Calling everyone in the State Department and Administration a liar makes you look and sound like a real jerk.

Here's a link to a Christian Science Monitor piece on the State Department budget issue and a couple of people who voted down the Department's requests. http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchannels/2012/1005/Libya-attack-Congressmen-casting-blame-voted-to-cut-diplomatic-security-budget .  Sure there are lots of blogs out there saying different things, but I trust you can summon the critical thinking skills I know you have to ferret out a better opinion than the one you provided above.

Best regards,

Art,

Something tells me if Bush was Pres. you would be outraged with me as I still would be outraged.

" Certainly there has been a debate in Congress as to how much money should be given the State Department for security."   As always with leftists, you say the answer is more money.  How about better use of less money?  That's the option we need to start taking as a nation or are you pleased with borrowing 40% of every dollar spent to support a bloated, redundant Gov't, a grown and growing welfare state, overpaid Gov't workers and the benefit/retirement packages which are breaking budgets.  The security failure in Lybia had nothing to do with budgets Art.  To claim so is flat out crap, so why try?

More crap: "After all, you can't protect every Federal employee and facility from every potential threat. "  Huh, not granting requests for more security and not allowing armed security forces in the embassy is an acceptable attempt to defend American soil?  I'm glad one of your loved ones wasn't slaughtered in an unprotected US Embassy on 9/11 after warnings of attack and repeated requests for beefed sucurity were denied.

More crap:  "That is a statement of such gross ignorance I just couldn't let it go unchallenged"  And where is the challenge Art?  No where.

Most crap:  "Calling everyone in the State Department and Administration a liar makes you look and sound like a real jerk."  Huh, where did I say that Art?   No where.  Guess you look and sound like a real jerk for making that up.  I will accept a public apology.

Have you been in a news blackout Art?  The State Dept. apologized for a video slamming muslims before anyone knew anything about it,  then the terrorist attack on the Embassy was told to us by Obama and his surrotates to have been a protest which got out of hand.    Obama and  all his surrogates spoke out on it and blamed the attack on a stupid movie and continued to do so till just a couple of days ago?  Romney accurately called that crap immediately and was blasted by the lefties in the media.  In the last couple of days the lie has crumbled, State Dept. threw Obama under the bus and Obama threw Hillary under the bus.  Bill won't like that.  It is called a cover up Art and for the life of me why do you condone it?  Ever heard of 'Fast and Furious'?

[admin]

Tree, I'm a little confused here. I don't really know what happened at the embassy (and could it be that the State Dept. didn't know either, at least not immediately? Are they not dependent on the very same embassy for info?), but what seems reasonable to assume is:

• There was a video.
• There were violent protests, in many countries, not just Libya
• There were budget cuts to embassy safety

On the latter:

For the past two years, House Republicans have continued to deprioritize the security forces protecting State Department personnel around the world. In fiscal year 2011, lawmakers shaved $128 million off of the administration's request for embassy security funding. House Republicans drained off even more funds in fiscal year 2012 -- cutting back on the department's request by $331 million.

How it it that if the Administration request funds for security which are denied by Republican lawmakers, the latter nevertheless blames the former? It could very well be the Administration made some mistakes, but should't those in favor of these rather specific budget cuts at least share some of the blame?

Now, I'm aware that the security guy at the embassy claims he made several requests for more security. He won't have been the only one.

However, budgets tend to be limited, especially those that are curtailed. Awkward trade-offs ensue, and only perfect foresight would enable an allocator of funds to make perfect decisions. Without perfect foresight, errors will be made and some of these errors have much bigger consequences than others, unfortunately.

[Tree]

Tree, I'm a little confused here. I don't really know what happened at the embassy (and could it be that the State Dept. didn't know either, at least not immediately? Are they not dependent on the very same embassy for info?), but what seems reasonable to assume is:

• There was a video.
• There were violent protests, in many countries, not just Libya
• There were budget cuts to embassy safety

On the latter:

For the past two years, House Republicans have continued to deprioritize the security forces protecting State Department personnel around the world. In fiscal year 2011, lawmakers shaved $128 million off of the administration's request for embassy security funding. House Republicans drained off even more funds in fiscal year 2012 -- cutting back on the department's request by $331 million.

How it it that if the Administration request funds for security which are denied by Republican lawmakers, the latter nevertheless blames the former? It could very well be the Administration made some mistakes, but should't those in favor of these rather specific budget cuts at least share some of the blame?

Now, I'm aware that the security guy at the embassy claims he made several requests for more security. He won't have been the only one.

However, budgets tend to be limited, especially those that are curtailed. Awkward trade-offs ensue, and only perfect foresight would enable an allocator of funds to make perfect decisions. Without perfect foresight, errors will be made and some of these errors have much bigger consequences than others, unfortunately.

I'm a litle confused STP.  There is plenty of money for security.  Arming our guys with bullets may help.  Changing the rules of engagement to allow our guys to defend themselves may help.  Identifying the threats and acting  accordingly takes adult leadership.  It's a tough sell to lay fault on lack of security priorities on Republicans.  Sometimes the answer isn't wasting more money it is identifying threats and preparing accordingly.

Are we trying to prove what we beleive or are we seeking the truth?  All need to open their eyes.

All can learn from Laura Logan and her realization that the administration is either ignorantly underestimating the threats or is lying about the threats.

Take 20 mins and watch.  At least watch from 18:to to the end.

http://sheikyermami.com/2012/10/10/lara-logans-speech/